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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |

Darth Gustav
Interwebs Cooter Explosion Fatal Ascension
1704
|
Posted - 2012.11.16 20:57:00 -
[1] - Quote
Player > Hi, I'd like to borrow 1 billion ISK please.
NPC > Great, just fill out this form and we'll deposit the balance (minus fees) into your wallet! Then, all you have to do is repay us in a timely fashion and CONCORD won't kill your ship.
Player > That's great!
NPC > Thanks for doing business with Eve Bank of Legitimacy!
Player > No no no, thank you.
Player then transfers 1b isk to his main and forgets that alt account ever existed, buying PLEX with the proceeds in an effort to perpetuate this scheme with a different "free" paid account.
Yeah, great idea! Sign me up! He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |

Darth Gustav
Interwebs Cooter Explosion Fatal Ascension
1704
|
Posted - 2012.11.16 21:08:00 -
[2] - Quote
Val'Dore wrote:Wait, you don't actually believe banks don't demand collateral... do you? In the case mentioned by the OP, the "collateral" is concisely defined as CONCORD's right to shoot me if I fail to pay.
Obviously the player has nothing disposable worth the value he's trying to borrow, otherwise they wouldn't be borrowing the money they'd be selling the collateral.
Since CONCORD activity was the only collateral specified, in this case yes.
I believe there would be no other collateral involved because those were the specified parameters.
Can you come up with a logical situation where collateral would be equivalent to the value of the loan but the individual would prefer to not sell their collateral, instead dealing with a lender, to meet a financial requirement in-game?
Because I can't. He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |

Darth Gustav
Interwebs Cooter Explosion Fatal Ascension
1705
|
Posted - 2012.11.16 21:39:00 -
[3] - Quote
Val'Dore wrote:Darth Gustav wrote:Val'Dore wrote:Wait, you don't actually believe banks don't demand collateral... do you? In the case mentioned by the OP, the "collateral" is concisely defined as CONCORD's right to shoot me if I fail to pay. Obviously the player has nothing disposable worth the value he's trying to borrow, otherwise they wouldn't be borrowing the money they'd be selling the collateral. Since CONCORD activity was the only collateral specified, in this case yes. I believe there would be no other collateral involved because those were the specified parameters. Can you come up with a logical situation where collateral would be equivalent to the value of the loan but the individual would prefer to not sell their collateral, instead dealing with a lender, to meet a financial requirement in-game? Because I can't. Don't spend much time in the Market forum do you. Not really, no.
Did you have an answer to my question about disposable collateral and its sale vs. a loan against its value? He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |

Darth Gustav
Interwebs Cooter Explosion Fatal Ascension
1711
|
Posted - 2012.11.16 22:16:00 -
[4] - Quote
ISD Cura Ursus wrote:Darth Gustav wrote:Val'Dore wrote:Darth Gustav wrote:Val'Dore wrote:Wait, you don't actually believe banks don't demand collateral... do you? In the case mentioned by the OP, the "collateral" is concisely defined as CONCORD's right to shoot me if I fail to pay. Obviously the player has nothing disposable worth the value he's trying to borrow, otherwise they wouldn't be borrowing the money they'd be selling the collateral. Since CONCORD activity was the only collateral specified, in this case yes. I believe there would be no other collateral involved because those were the specified parameters. Can you come up with a logical situation where collateral would be equivalent to the value of the loan but the individual would prefer to not sell their collateral, instead dealing with a lender, to meet a financial requirement in-game? Because I can't. Don't spend much time in the Market forum do you. Not really, no. Did you have an answer to my question about disposable collateral and its sale vs. a loan against its value? I can give this one a shot. Let's say you have a rare item, say a T2 BPO and you don't want to use it, but you DO want to leverage it's value in ISK. So you use a third party to hold the BPO and gain a loan equal to the BPO's declared value. You pay interest or other important considerations and then at the term expiry of the loan receive your BPO back. There are other "one of a kind" or "few of a kind" item categories, but that is the gist. (Another example is a rigged expensive ship.....) When the item is difficult to replace, then selling it is not as attractive as using it as collateral. Of course, the flip side is that if you have such an item Your last statement may be the most important.
But beyond that, the situation you describe is still unhelpful to people who actually don't have any ISK or property of value, which was the OP's whole point. Beyond that, with the exception of Tech II BPO's there is virtually no such thing as "one of a kind." (obvious exceptions are rare ships etc)
Nobody I know would put their T2 BPO into a third party's hands.
Would you? He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |

Darth Gustav
Interwebs Cooter Explosion Fatal Ascension
1711
|
Posted - 2012.11.16 22:18:00 -
[5] - Quote
Oopsy Bear wrote:ISD Cura Ursus wrote: I can give this one a shot.
Let's say you have a rare item, say a T2 BPO and you don't want to use it, but you DO want to leverage it's value in ISK. So you use a third party to hold the BPO and gain a loan equal to the BPO's declared value. You pay interest or other important considerations and then at the term expiry of the loan receive your BPO back.
There are other "one of a kind" or "few of a kind" item categories, but that is the gist. (Another example is a rigged expensive ship.....)
When the item is difficult to replace, then selling it is not as attractive as using it as collateral.
Of course, the flip side is that if you have such an item
I'll admit that is an interesting idea. The downside is that we have now devised a way for only rich people to get loans. That was why I posted that the ISD's final statement was the most important.
If you've already got the ISK or an item worth the ISK, what's a loan good for? He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |

Darth Gustav
Interwebs Cooter Explosion Fatal Ascension
1711
|
Posted - 2012.11.16 22:20:00 -
[6] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Mr Pragmatic wrote:Eve is a universe built on harsh capitalism (IMO)
Any form of capitalism needs a strong financial system. Would it not be interesting if there was a way to deposit money into a NPC Bank corp and the ISK accusers interest over time.
Also from this NPC Bank, you could take out loans and if you don't pay them back conord will come after you.
This would be a good way for starter corps to build some financially stability and encourage different forms of game play.
Or am I just daft? Discuss and troll hard. Create alt borrow all the ISKs and give them to main Abandon alt. Clearly you stole that idea from my post one page back. He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |

Darth Gustav
Interwebs Cooter Explosion Fatal Ascension
1712
|
Posted - 2012.11.16 22:53:00 -
[7] - Quote
Beekeeper Bob wrote:Darth Gustav wrote:Player > Hi, I'd like to borrow 1 billion ISK please.
NPC > Great, just fill out this form and we'll deposit the balance (minus fees) into your wallet! Then, all you have to do is repay us in a timely fashion and CONCORD won't kill your ship.
Player > That's great!
NPC > Thanks for doing business with Eve Bank of Legitimacy!
Player > No no no, thank you.
Player then transfers 1b isk to his main and forgets that alt account ever existed, buying PLEX with the proceeds in an effort to perpetuate this scheme with a different "free" paid account.
Yeah, great idea! Sign me up! Even if players don't know who you are, Concord should....then allow Concord to go after all your accounts.....  I live in null-sec?
Bob, are you trying to advocate CONCORD in null-sec? He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |

Darth Gustav
Interwebs Cooter Explosion Fatal Ascension
1760
|
Posted - 2012.11.17 20:14:00 -
[8] - Quote
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:Darth Gustav wrote:Nobody I know would put their T2 BPO into a third party's hands.
Would you? Hmm I have held T2 BPOs as collateral some times, what's strange with that? I stand corrected.
Were they ammo BPOs or something more valuable?
Come on, you can tell! He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom |
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